Jeeyoon Kim: Transcript
Podcast and Video, with show notes
Jeeyoon Kim:
And I think often as we are so distracted world with devices and technology people drawn into story, people are drawn into just human, genuine experience and connection. So as innovative, it sounds like it actually comes down to it, I just eager to connect more, which seems more rare, rare, rare in this time, and the performer talk about the emotion. Performer will try to talk about that musical feeling and visuals. Sometimes when I bring the visuals and the projector, it's all connected so that I can help audience to experience better. So I believe the power of storytelling, I believe a power of simply you and me, we're going to share this music in a very meaningful way.
Leah Roseman:
Hi, you're listening to Conversations with Musicians with Leah Roseman. This podcast strives to inspire you through the personal stories of the diversity of musicians worldwide with in-depth conversations and great music that reveal the depth and breadth to a life in music. Jeeyoon Kim is a very special concert pianist who's opened meaningful connections to new audiences through her innovative concerts, albums, podcast, and now her book, "Whenever You're Ready". You'll learn how she sold out her Carnegie Hall debut recital without knowing one person in New York, without an agent or winning a major competition. She's generously shared three tracks from some of her albums that punctuate this episode and please head over to her website, which is linked in the description. I was so honored when Jeeyoon agreed to be part of the series because I knew her wisdom, personal story and her music making would resonate strongly with you. Like all my episodes, you can watch this on my YouTube channel or listen to the podcast. And I've also linked the transcript to my website, leahroseman.com, where you can sign up for my weekly newsletter to get access to sneak peeks for upcoming guests. Like her book, Jeeyoon's valuable perspectives and insights are helpful to both musicians and listeners. This is an episode full of inspiring and heartwarming stories.
Hi Jeeyoon, thanks so much for joining me here today.
Jeeyoon Kim:
Thank you for having me.
Leah Roseman:
I was just saying to you before we started recording that I did discover you mostly through your book, which I'll hold up, "Whenever You're Ready: How to compose the Life of Your Dreams, which is a beautiful book and I know you wrote it not just for fellow musicians, but for everyone really to have tools to help them in their lives.
Jeeyoon Kim:
Yes, I did. I mean the title "Whenever You're Ready" is actually came from, I was waiting for my Carnegie Hall debut concert and often there's a manager, stage manager holding the door to the stage and this particular one was completely hidden and then manager holding the door asking for my cue and say, "whenever you're ready". And that very moment, a lot of my life comes through my mind and still make the decision within and I'm going to walk to the stage. And I realized that all of these things that I do in life to prepare to being on stage is so related to, of course, fellow musicians, but how to live life. So I wanted to make a book perhaps just like a friend. Sometimes you hear all this life reasons that you gurus and whatnot, but your friend say, "these things really helped me". Then all of a sudden you listen to that. And I wanted my book to be very friendly and gentle and just share what I learned and hopefully as a reader you get a sense of inspiration and hopefully whenever you are ready to embark, whatever the journey that might be, this book might give you courage to make that first step into unknown.
Leah Roseman:
I really enjoyed reading it and I was rereading it again to prepare for today and it really resonated with me because I think we have a lot of the same outlook and habits and I kept thinking "yes, yes!" I just really was things that I use. Now, I actually didn't know about your podcast before I read the book, and then in the book you point us to some podcast episodes. So, Journey Through Classical Piano is very well loved around the world.
Jeeyoon Kim:
Yes. It actually started during pandemic I think as you could resonate with that too, that often we as a freelance musician, we sometimes get an interview by podcasts like this, or in the past there's radio news, all of that. And then I was interviewed one of the podcasts in the past and one day I thought, what if I make my own podcast and talk whatever I want to talk about with the world? And that was very daunting idea at that time. But at the same time, kind of that curiosity of, oh, that would be really fun. And that was my fun project. And then I just set it aside because we have so many hours a day and I was just keep focusing on what I was doing. And then that thought just keep coming back to me like, oh, what kind of mic, my free time?
I realized myself researching more about podcasts and then finally I gave myself a permission to go for it. And with the first episode it was a mic - Sound quality was really bad, but I thought to ask myself, will I have fun? Yes. Will I help someone in the process? I think yes, then why not? So my mission as a pianist is to bridge this beauty of classical music to the people may not have access and I as a classical musician is such a saddening when people say classical music is dying, classical music is difficult. And so I wanted to kind of create some home, like invite people to my living room and I experiment with many of my friends that have no idea what classical music is and they're like, I don't know, but I'll play one piece for you. This piece is about heartache.
I really feel this composer, I don't know what he was going through, but I feel that happy yet sadness and that complexity and I talk about my emotion related to it and I play. They're like, oh my gosh, Jeeyoon, what is this about? I never thought that piece of classical music would touch my heart in such a way that I never experienced. And then I thought podcast is such a great medium because it's intimate. I am actually introvert. I practice to be extrovert, to become a musician and on stage everything but podcast fits me in a way that I just talk to you like a friend. And at this point it is mostly 10 to 15 minutes of episode and one piece of music. Most of the 90% of the music is actually performed by me, which makes it very more intimate in such a way that I talk about this piece struggles as a pianist and the thoughts behind it and maybe some historical findings that helped me to understand the piece just like living room performance. And I think it's moving forward. I will use other people's performance, but when I get to use my own recording, that's the most intimate experience I found.
Leah Roseman:
Now we're going to play a track from your first recording 10 More Minutes. And I was going to ask you about this Brahms Intermezzo because I grew up hearing my brother practice it. He was a serious pianist at the time and it was just the sound of going to sleep for a certain time was him staying up late practicing this and your performance is really beautiful. So what does this piece mean to you?
Jeeyoon Kim:
I thought at first when I encountered this piece and I was struck by just the beauty, the beauty, and then as I get into the piece more and that discover my difficult lifetime experience in the past sometimes often bittersweet moment of my life and a lot of heartache, whether that is a loss of someone or it's related to most of the loss, but yet at the end I'm here, I'm alive, I'm fully content at this moment. And so that juxtaposition of complexity has always hit me hard. And whenever I perform, there's often I become teary eyes no matter how many times I perform this piece. And I often feel like I can't play this piece in the middle of the program. So I often program at the end because it's hard to recover from it if I really perform it in such a way that I want to perform this piece. 10 More Minutes album is actually a collection of encores.
This piece came like a best friend to me just because it was with me, has been with me for a long time. And no matter how many times I perform, how many times I practice, how many times I listened to again with someone else performing, it reminds me why I am a classical musician and the beauty of just a piece of music can do to our soul and to me and those deep sense of connection emotionally with the composer and ultimately with myself and hopefully that connection resonate with listener and a lot of listeners with audiences to say that I thought of my past, my mom who passed away or whatever, their experience, this piece brings another memory or feelings to their life. And I know when a piece of music is that powerful, I carry along for myself and for others.
Leah Roseman:
You're about to hear the Brahms Intermezzo Opus 118, number two from Jeeyoon Kim's album. 10 More Minutes. (music)
Beautiful. Thanks so much for sharing your thoughts and your music as well. Now, I don't always like to start with people's childhood, but there are elements that you described in your book that I think are really interesting to bring people's attention to. So you grew up in South Korea and even the way you started is different to what a lot of us are used to in North America where a kid would go to a lesson once a week. So it was multiple times a week. You were four years old. Can you describe for people what that was like? The process?
Jeeyoon Kim:
Yeah, I think that actually my book starts with a scene where four years old walking in the alleyway of countryside of Korea with a backpack with full of piano music and going my way about to go to Piano Institute, which was a daily thing except Saturday and Sunday. And my parents were both business so they didn't really was micromanaged my life even as a four years old, I just went, I knew I had to go to Piano Institute on my own. So I remember there's maybe just three or four blocks, but that was definitely a daily journey. And I stopped by this grocery store or there's little snack vendor that called sell toppoki, which is a little Korean snack with a rice cake and things. And I was thinking, oh, should I have one a snack on the way or not? I'm just thinking about it.
And then I went to the Piano Institute every single day and I took it very seriously, just like serious businesswoman going to some work done or something. And so when I'm thinking back on it and now I live in America, seeing other kids in four years old going to institute by yourself and it feels foreign, feels impossible. And I realized how different that was that time. I don't think it is same unfortunately in Korea it's safety issue, a lot of difference that changed since 1984. But I'm so glad that I learned independence such a young age that every musician at some point have to learn that the habit of consistency and I just, my environment made me into that setting from the beginning. And without that structure I still managed to create it on my own, even now.
Leah Roseman:
It's interesting, I was interviewed recently about this podcast and they were asking if I thought what all my guests had in common as musicians because people play so many different types of music, fulfill different roles in our industry, but I felt like everyone has persistence. You just keep doing it no matter how hard it is, no matter when you start or what you're doing.
Jeeyoon Kim:
I agree.
Leah Roseman:
And you went to this competitive arts high school also pretty different than what I was shocked by the public rankings. That was just,
Jeeyoon Kim:
Yeah, now I thinking back how cruel that is, but it was so natural because that's just how it's done and I didn't think much about it. But looking back on it, yes, every piano exam once a semester, the end of four months, every four months we had a piano exam, which was open curtain or closed curtain. Then the ranking of all of the divided violinist or pianist, it is not mixed it either. So where you're standing is on the pianist, the ranking. But there were a lot of piano major. I remember at least a hundred thinking about it, like a hundred people majoring in high school, in art high school. It's crazy. But we saw the ranking very cruelly afterwards. But first three, top three will always someone we could expect technically so clean. There's no question like, oh yeah. And so number one again, oh, so-and-so number three, right? That was very cruel, but that was the society, a lot of the competition. And I think that competition is still there. And that I realized is the competition is all everywhere, whether it's within yourself and with others. And often in when you try to compete with music, it's very toxic environment, which I wanted to drive away from, but I actually lived in that competition competitive world for a long time.
Leah Roseman:
And in terms of those a hundred pianists that you're in school with, you write about that in the book that maybe they didn't pursue music as a career.
Jeeyoon Kim:
Yeah, I know, including myself, three out of the hundred that are doing something with piano currently. Yeah,
Leah Roseman:
This comes up with various guests. I think there's an element of burnout, especially from a young age.
Jeeyoon Kim:
Yeah, I think people don't realize in order to become a classical musician, like you're talking violinist or pianist, and it doesn't matter if the instrument, you often start four or five and you think it only Mozart started when he was three or something and everyone else just started in the high school, middle school. No, we all started when we were like four. And a lot of people, by the time they got into college, they've been already playing 14 years of their life. And then the unfortunate part is that your journey didn't even get started yet. And then often we pursue higher degree and 10 years afterwards that we still, you didn't even start it yet. You didn't even start it yet. Then you are in the competition pool or then you audition pool and then you feel like, why am I doing this and do I even enjoy it?
And I think that the burnout is almost like natural result of doing one thing for such a long time. And if you do that, you have to find a way to refresh yourself or some balance. Otherwise it's like doom. You are doomed to have it. It's more of how are you going to deal with it and you better equip yourself whether than I'm never going to burn out because everybody will, if you think that you're going to start something from years of four and then 40 and 15, 60 and it's a marathon, and I think a lot of people like, oh, at some point once I make it, once I make it to, I don't know what the definition might be, once I win this competition, once I win this audition for orchestra or once I get the position I'll be fine. But then they burn out, then they realize, oh, all life I pursue is this what I wanted? So I think more than any other field, our musicians have to be awake and keep asking questions and not that fundamental question that do I love music because I know we fundamentally love that. That's why we are here. But what in aspect of it that you enjoy? Is this a performing? Is this a teaching? Is there both? What aspect that you will refresh in yourself is it to stop yourself from serious burnout?
Leah Roseman:
Now you mentioned teaching, you're an educator, but I found it interesting and understandable that you got your doctorate from Indiana University. I did go there, by the way, for my Master's. So I
Jeeyoon Kim:
Oh, you did!
Leah Roseman:
I have some familiarity with it and then you decided pursue another Master's in pedagogy.
Jeeyoon Kim:
Yeah, I think first of all, everybody thought that I was so crazy after doctorate in Indiana, which was really rigorous program, one of the rigorous program which you had to prepare seven or eight different repertoire. I mean the recitals, you have to do that not included in your repertoire list when you auditioned. So which meant that series five or six, seven years of higher degree in the master's and doctorate mean. And then afterwards I realized that, oh, I finally understood that I don't know enough, but one thing I learned from the doctorate degree was that I know how to find it. Maybe the methodology that if I have a curious about something and I know how to find it and I know what is the right path rather than in performance practice. So that was really tremendous lesson for me. But then afterwards I realized even my teacher at Indiana University doesn't know how to teach four years old, that really bothered me.
And she can teach any high level performer that you think it is flawless that she will make it better. Beethoven sonatas, Chopin, doesn't matter. But then bringing first step into the intermediate, that was a big mystery to me. And I think I'm actually educator at heart. I like to digest pieces for even audience and just create educator as a bridge. And the fact that I have no idea about how to bring the beginner doesn't matter, even it's adult beginner to just first Bach, Bach piece or something was so much of curiosity a hole in my life. And you know what? I'm going to go back to piano pedagogy master's degree and just to that satisfy my hunger. And then when I did that piano pedagogy degree and I realized everything I learned in the, even from my four years old to Doctorate degree all my life as a musician made sense.
Now everything in the right organized box, it's hard to explain in words, but now I knew how to digest and if I can teach five years old, do this very concept, that means I understood. And I can explain that means if you can teach any concept to the child, that means you really simplifying the simplicity is the high level of teaching. And I really strive for it and made me humble again and okay, I did all of this higher education, but now make it simple to general audience, to the students, to whoever I meet and I don't know better, but this very thing I want to talk about. But this actually came from a lot of research and a lot of extra education, but I wanted to make it simple.
Leah Roseman:
Hi, just a short break from the episode, which I hope you're enjoying so far. If you want to check out over a hundred episodes you may have missed in addition to your podcast player or YouTube, I have an extensive website, leahroseman.com with show notes, transcripts, the complete catalog of episodes, and you can sign up there for my weekly newsletter to get access to Sneak Peeks of upcoming guests. Please do share your favorite episodes with your friends, follow me on social media and share my posts. And if you can spare a few dollars to help support the series, that would be amazing. And you can find that link in the show notes. I'm an independent podcaster and I really do need the help of my listeners. Now back to the episode.
How do you change how you teach with different personalities of your students, different learning styles?
Jeeyoon Kim:
Yeah, well obviously that is part of the education degree that you start from the learning style and you understand what is my learning style too. So that's something that go back into, I was already, I think I'm an innate communicator one-to-one setting. So I know what this person empathy or try to think for their perspective. And if I can sense it, that person is not getting it and I try to another way in this way that way. And so I think it is really related to communication skill to vary the medium. And if it's a visual learner, I don't want to only give a visual learning tools. I use it a lot, but yet I want to give some other way so that this person is also expand their learning styles too. So again, this is the theory that I learned modality of the people's learning styles different, but that doesn't mean that we need to adapt our style only to that person, but then just understand the theory of basics of it.
But then I see it, okay, this person's actually lacking this way of education, so I want to just plug in a little bit more different way of explain or conversation. And a lot of it, I think it is just listening to, listening their body cues, listening to their life. I often really surprised that when students are not able to accept what I'm giving may not be anything related to their modality of how they learn, but the struggles in their mind or things that are bothering them or so it can be life issue. So I have a lot of adult students too. So I often ask, did you sleep well? Are you eating well? Are you moving well? I'm just covering the basics first and then I stepping forward, is there anything that difficult to your life right now can be piano related or not? And I open a little bit of a channel for them to open up and it is a conversation I always find that is a piano therapy because music is therapeutic.
But then they may share some of struggles if they may not. But once that they can be able to let it go of whatever the troubles of they have, then they make music better because they actually be honest with themselves and the transparency of it. And I think it is the same with kids too and young students that may struggle with the tremendous pressure of the school and other society and things. And I wanted to be there to listen to them and make up music as a healing process. Like this is not a test. We don't do music just because to be a more skilled pianist, more skilled violinist, we use music to share, to get, deepen your relationship with yourself and to get connect with the people that maybe passed away or this music and the composer and ultimately to connect whatever that could be. So then any of the modality that I use works in that open foundation.
Leah Roseman:
And in terms of the way you've, your career has blossomed as a performer, but supporting yourself also through teaching in contrasting to had you taken a position in a university, you'd be involved with their bureaucratic stuff, teaching maybe higher level students. Do you ever think about that or speak with friends who have those kinds of jobs?
Jeeyoon Kim:
I think as a doctorate, graduator with double degree with piano pedagogy, at some point in my life I thought nobody can compete in terms of credentials with what I have. If they only think that in order to professor in university you need a doctorate, preferably good university like Indiana University. And in my mind I'm so qualified, in fact I'm overqualified. But then I realized that doesn't work that way. The university position is like a God given. It has to come from somewhere else. It's not like you want it and you can get it. It involves so many different layers to it. Maybe there's some politics involved, maybe there's some debt work. You might have to start somewhere in the city that you don't want to live for a long time. And the letter up and I had no idea. And maybe sometimes the one recommendation from your teacher that in the university, that recommendation get you there, just no questions asked.
Doesn't matter. I mean, as you know, the musical world has been going through a lot of changes, but in the old times there's not really one method works. And in my mind I was diligently doing everything that maybe, maybe, but I actually didn't think that I will become professor. But I thought part of it, that's my option and I just pursue my curiosity. But then now I have this degrees that why not that's professors not a great, but then in the midst of it, I have friends that in a professor position in a university and I realize in a university position as shiny as it looked from outside, it's a lot of administration work, a lot of repetition, a lot of just basic instruction. And then four years later you start over. It's not a long-term thing, but it's a lot of emails and meetings and then you are becoming a little soldier for the bigger organization, which is university so that the bigger organization want you to do X, Y, and Z in order for the mission or whatever the organization wants, but maybe that may not in line with what you want to do in your life.
And I realized a lot of my friends are agonized with lack of time, but then responsibility that because they feel their tenure and they have to do X, Y, Z and they don't want to do it. Those positions may on Indiana University, those professors only teach certain hours and they can perform and do nothing in emails or they don't have to do anything. It's like a fantasy and it's 0.0 0, 0, 0 0 1, and that is even disappearing. So I had a reality check and wake up call one my position that I thought I would get. It didn't come through. And I realized, you know what? I don't think I would like to enjoy being professor, the work involved with it. I love teaching but not everything attached to it. And then what I liked was the name, maybe the privilege looks like it sounded, and also the security.
But then I have to question everything again. What is the security? If I am working at someplace and mentally so stressed, is that secure? Is that secure enough for me? It wasn't secure because it was not fun. And so for some people it's a perfect fit, but for me, I had to revisit and even if I have all these degrees that may be qualified for the job, but me as a person doesn't fit for the position, I have to create my own position for myself so that I can do all of those things that I'm interested in doing.
Leah Roseman:
So if we could talk about your innovative concerts, because many people listening won't know that you do things very differently. Maybe we could talk about your Carnegie Hall debut and how that worked.
Jeeyoon Kim:
Yeah, I think we have to kind of go back in tracks just because we just talked about the, I'm giving up the idea of professorship and that's where when I decided no adjunct, no part-time, no teaching one course or whatever, actually cut off, just say no no more. And then that was actually very difficult. For some reason I always taught course or two in the hope of whatever, but then I decided, no, no, you're not going to move somewhere that you don't want to go. So then I turned, okay, what I want to do, what I want to do as a pianist is obviously to share my music but actually connect with the audience in such a way that it's people that don't know classical music or know classical music and going to a concert. It's not like just a nice evening or just thing.
But they're really passionate about the music as much as I am and I wanted to open the door for them. And then first thing I came to my mind was to create an album, which is a dream for many of musician to make your own album. But then the Sony didn't call me Deutsche Grammophon didn't call me. And then, and a lot of people, they have their mystery of how one create an album. And then I realized, what if I just record an album, I'm going to make my own label. But then still there's question remained how much does it cost? What is a concept? And so I thought, what does Sony makes album? What studio do they use? What photographers do they use? How do they do it? I just need to come up with a concept and then I need a funding to create it and the level of Sony would make.
And so I decided I have a solid concept, which is I shared the 10 more minutes. It's not 10 years more, but it's 10 more minutes. It's a very humble wish, something longing for the experience, whatever that experience keep you bliss. And for me it was encore and the concert is over. Everybody wishes, let's do one more that communal wish. So I wanted to capture that longing feeling into the album. So that was a $30,000 that come up with that funding and to make asking for donation video itself for three minutes cost $8,000. And I thought, okay, I will include that. And that's the numbers such a high 30,000 for the CD production, it's included that just three minutes of video making was, "hi everyone, this is my idea and I would like you to be part of it."That kind of, and then I had to practice the same sentence over again that "I have this project, I want you to be part of it and I need you to support."
That was not a big deal in my mind, but it was so big deal to actually talk to my friends or family or even strangers. I felt so small to ask for money. And that humbling experience was like, it's okay for you to say no, but I felt so guilty. Maybe I made them feel bad. But then there was a $10 coming, a hundred dollars here, a thousand dollars, sometimes more. The people started to react and with message attached, like Jeeyoon, "I love your music. Go for it. I love the concept. Great. I can't wait for the album." Every dollar donated had a love letter attached to it. And then I felt like, oh my gosh, this is my project. I thought, but it became everybody's project and everybody who are part of it become their baby too. And then they become lifelong enthusiastic fan.
And I was so surprised to discover this mechanism, how come you pay money but then you are invested in, you become fan? What is this? Just something odd about this. But then I invited them into my playground and I realized I am also part of this project in the big picture of this music making, I am contributing. It's not me, but I am as artist. I am creating something for people and I'm just doing my part of it. So this funding was successfully funded and then the next one was the Carnegie. Everybody will say at least once or twice if you're a musician, you'll be hearing someone saying, when are you going to play in Carnegie? I heard that too more than a couple times in my mind playing Carnegie, it felt like impossible.
But then one of my fans who contributed to 10 More Minutes went to Mitsuko Uchida's concert in Carnegie and bought this postcard that it is a picture of Carnegie. And after the concert and she asked me to go Jeeyoon and can you write "why not" for the postcard? And she said, why not? Yes, please write it. Why not? And then this person gave me that postcard to me and I look at the postcard of Carnegie and say, why not? And I left. But then that night I couldn't sleep because actually for the first time I asked myself, why not? Why not? And so I called Carnegie booking office next morning, nine o'clock in New York time and someone's get the phone after one ring, just like a New Yorker. And I said," hi, I'm a classical pianist. My name is Jeeyoon Kim, I'm just wondering how do I play there?"
Silence. And I was thinking like, oh my gosh, I hope she doesn't say just go and practice, practice, practice. But then she told me, next five minutes or so long list of what you need, you need this form, this, that, and then you need a presentor and then we need to verify whatever. That was like a long list. And I listen one ear and then the other, this goes away because it was so many too much information. But then after I hang up, I realized there's a sense of light is turning on inside of me thinking, Ooh, playing Carnegie Hall. It's not a fantasy, it's step by step-by-step method. If you follow this, whatever that is, I'll be playing. It's just actionable thing. So I follow the action and I found the presenter who believe in what I do. And from that phone call, two and a half years later, all of the people who donate this project, a lot of state Indiana, California, flew to be in my Carnegie Hall debut concert.
And I was sold out concert without knowing a single person in New York. And I walked to the stage and said, welcome to my dream. And this particular concert as usual microphone is on the stage. There's no program given at the beginning because I'm going to explain to you, don't you worry, don't you worry. But when you walk out after the concert, you'll be given a program and there's no intermission. This is me and the music. You going to take this journey with me, this journey of I thought through every single possible way, what I'm going to say to you, what story I'm going to share, what program, what kind of emotions I am imagining for you to take. I'm a tour guide and I'm going to finish this so as even encore, how I want you to leave was planned is such in a way, it's like a theater in a way. Everything was in a very much thought through and of, there was some people who come to Carnegie Hall didn't know me and they were like, why? There is a microphone she's going to sing? There's no program. What's wrong with this classical concert? I, so I break breakthrough. I tried to break the rules that if that's interfering me to connect to the audience, that's the concept of my concert. No matter what I do, I question one more time.
I don't question the content. Content which is the music. I don't actually do the new age music. I'm playing very core classical music. But then I question, do I really need to go to the backstage and come back right out that is it necessary for whom do I need it or does it need it for the audience? And I realized I may need it, but audience don't need it. So then I didn't go to the backstage just for that second, I don't need it either. And the talking part, as much as simple as just talking to the audience, I think through, if I maybe start with a 10 sentence, what I want to tell the audience, but then at the end I might say four sentences. It's like a poetic. I have to practice what I'm going to say same way if I would perform.
And I think often as we are so distracted world with the devices and technology people drawn into story, people are drawn into just human, genuine experiencing connection. So as innovated, it sounds like it actually comes down to it. I just eager to connect more, which seems more rare where in this time and the performer talk about the emotion performer would try to talk about that musical feeling. And visuals, sometimes when I bring the visuals and the projector, it's all connected so that I can help audience to experience better. So I believe the power of storytelling, I believe a power of simply you and me we're going to share this music and a very meaningful way. There's no pretentious, there's no background music needed because you don't need it. And when I tried to go from that perspective, everybody said, you're doing something so different. Really. Why? So what is so different about it? But maybe it is different just because where we are now.
Leah Roseman:
Now you're going to hear Nikolai Kapustin's Concert Etude, Opus 40, number six, Pastoral from Jeeyoon Kim's album. Sium.(music)
Well, I certainly hope I can go to one of your live concerts, but people can check out your YouTube channel. You have excerpts of some of your performances and I think your podcast gives us a taste, although it's not multimedia the same way.
Your recent project, Sium, you did an interesting tour with 17 different concerts.
Jeeyoon Kim:
Yeah, I did. That was adventure for sure. So this offer came about is they ask you either do all 17 in one month or no nothing because maybe it's routed such a way that it works. Just one artist go through all these little towns. I was thinking that sounds like those rock band in the bus and going to town to town, which is not really glamorous. But then I was curious, I was curious to go to the corner of America and also who I'm become after going through the 17 concerts, what kind of musian I would become, what kind of person that I would become. I was curious for that. So I said, yes, bring it on, let's do it. And I have to say this particular tour was one of the hardest and one of the most rewarding concert tour I've done. And I hired my close friend to be a tech manager because there's the projector, it's matches with my piece.
So there's a lot of multimedia stuff that I cannot train someone to do it and not alone that between the city, sometimes you have to drive seven to eight hours and that's only a day back-to-back concert or something. And I could not do everything myself. I have to be performer at some point. So I did that and I didn't count how many concerts left. That was like the being now as on steroid because I could not do, okay now I did five now 12 more to go. I could not be in that mindset at all. Otherwise I would crumble into the pieces. I feel like I want to quit everything. I want to go home. And so I just be in the new city with a curiosity mindset like, oh, this city, all this piano, interesting piano, everything comes with a different challenge, different environment, different audience.
And when I came to, but one thing for sure I realized is that audience, those cities that may not have luxury of having concerts every week, witha playing or Kissin playing or orchestra, these are the town that this live performance is a treat because it happens maybe once three months or once or five months. This solo piano might be once a year. So for them, they're more in tuned in the mindset of old timer where there's a candlelight at night, they're cozy up and want to connect with the real person. So I connect with them and the way I present concert, it touched them in a way that they didn't expect. And a lot of people said, I thought I came to entertainment, which is this concert or show, but then they said, this was life-changing experience for me to connect. I don't know what you did, but I'm different now an hour and a half later.
And I don't think I did that. I think music did it, but I facilitated such a way that it made it possible for them. And I truly believe the way I did it made them curious about classical music, made them wanting to go more of classical music and perhaps maybe turn on radio NPR or something because one experience was such a positive experience of the connection, they want to do more. And that was so connected to with my mission. And then after the last 17 concert, before I play Encore, finally I told the audience and say, I have been in this tour for 17 concerts tour. And they were very surprised. And today was number 17. And people were really surprised to hear that because they realized that I was a part of that tour and they didn't realize this is number 17, I finished.
And that very moment, I was so surprised because unexpected emotion came to me and I started to cry and I didn't expect it at all. I was just sharing that this was number 17. But all of a sudden the sense of I did it, and this is number 17, how grateful, how amazing this was, how difficult it was, it was worth it too. And so many emotions came about and I was like, whoa, I still have an to play. And I told him I think I made it and I'm so grateful and I will play the Encore. And I play actually Brahms Intermezzo at the time, and I was literally trying not to drop my tears on the keyboard. But then my partner was videotaping and taking photos and he saw more than a half of audience was bawling too with me crying. And that was such an experience for everyone. And I will cherish that. And when I move forward in my life, whenever challenges, when in doubt, lean forward and trust that you'll come out stronger and better.
Leah Roseman:
Now in this album, this concert project you played by Debussy, it's very beautiful. Could we include that track as part of it in this episode?
Jeeyoon Kim:
Oh yeah, yeah, for sure, for sure. Think I am in love with Debussy, anything Debussy I love. I think a Debussy girl, I think his music making makes me a painter and free with a color of color of music. And one of the favorite thing I do is going to a museum of modern art in New York. And there's fifth floor, I forget, but there's a Monet section and there's a whole wall of water lilies. And I sit down and I didn't realize he took this painting for 20 years from beginning to the end and I am experiencing it his 20 years of struggle, doubts, life, thoughts, all of it. And I could feel it. And then his thing is, as all of the other Impressionist painters, it's evoke the image, evoke the sense of being there without doing every little details is expressed. And I think whenever I play Debussy, I become a painter and go wherever that music brings to. And often there's a piece that calls called Pagodas that I go to Korea when I go up to mountains every morning to get water for the day with my grandma and play badminton, and I hear gong sound in the Buddhist temple, smell the pine trees. I feel the fogs and somehow Debussy knows the sensation of Asia too. And all of it feels home for me and Debussy allows me to be more creative, allow to seeking more colors and have fun in the process.
Leah Roseman:
This next musical selection is Debussy's La plus que lente, from Jeeyoon Kim's album Sium. (music)
In one of your YouTubes about that tour we were just talking about, you were talking with one of your friends about playing on all the different pianos. You don't know what you're going to expect. And he was saying that you just bring out the best. It's like your attitude going in is, let's see what you can give me. I forget exactly the quote, but you know what I mean.
Jeeyoon Kim:
Yeah, it's interesting because pianists have this very unique challenge, which is you can't bring your own piano. And that challenge, it's sometimes good thing because what if you don't, you have bad instrument? So it's a fair game, but at the same time, every other musicians would agree the instrument, it's not a thing, but living organism and they speak to you. It's a living thing. I literally talk to my piano and little changes like maybe trebel side today it's a little more teeny, but maybe some humidity or I sense it, I talk to them and I don't name my instrument, but I literally take as a person who has temperaments personality in different moods. So whenever I go to a concert, it is very rare that, I mean there's maybe two or three times in my entire career that the piano is just perfect shape, that there's nothing I can complain about. Otherwise. The pianos, even if it's nine foot Steinway shiny instrument that everybody's rave about, they do have underlying health conditions. But when you go to these little towns when you play in this gym that they bring little grand piano you, in my mind I'm thinking, oh no, what is this piano?
But even then, it doesn't matter what kind of piano is in front of me, if it's Carnegie Hall or some little rundown hall in the upright that I take it just like a person believe in this instrument. Okay, let's have a conversation. I know you can do much more than you think you could. So let's see what you can do. And I go, oh, I see your little bit of here. And sometimes nice, you have this, such a nice voice in the bass, I'll use that immediately. We do have a strength as a pianist that you can recognize a weakness in strength and certain pieces accentuate that weakness more or strength more. So then often I struggle with a certain piece. I need so much more power and this piano doesn't give, but then give a lot of clarity, which is great. So I compliment the piano as it is and wanting more color, more you can do a little more.
But then I constantly have to adjust with my ear, my fingers to make a best out of it. Oftentimes the range of piano is, let's say it's really narrow, then I don't even get to the level 10 until I absolutely need it. Well, I stay in seven for a long, long time, even though I know I can go 10 just for the effect of the final piece or something. So I have to adjust every single aspect of my music making for this piano. And the result is that people adjust it, people adjust their ears too. So I believe that if I ask for more for the piano, like a person positivity and talking like a conversation more than you'd think, the piano responds so much more positively. And afterwards, I always thank the piano, like, good job, you made it. And then I get the comment from the audience. I never knew this piano can do that.
But on the side note, I make a list of things that this particular organization technician, and when you're leisurely time, please do X, Y, and Z. Because I also realize a lot of pianists, because they come and go, they don't really care about this particular piano and they don't really give a proper feedback other than fix it now or be very temperamental about it. And my approach is that piano technician only have an hour, which is only time for tuning. They cannot do the voicing, they cannot do regulation. All of the other things that I actually would like this piano to go, but I will tell the piano maybe there's some notes that missed really, really critical. I will say otherwise I make a note and send them to them afterwards, which is just a thank you note. And it's not about me, but it's about the health condition of this particular piano and the community.
Leah Roseman:
Okay, interesting. Now you paired each piece of music with a photo from Allen T. Brown. So I Googled him. I'm not sure if I found the right guy. Did he write a book?
Jeeyoon Kim:
Yeah, he did. He did? Yeah. Yeah. So he's actually a friend of mine who is 90 years old, very interesting life. And I don't know, he would call himself a photographer, but he is a photographer. And 30 years ago or 40 years ago, he was more active with the film, black and white film photography. And the one time three, two years ago when I was doing this new project Sium, I wanted to have paired with visuals, but I was really having a hard time because I actually hired a photographer, create an image that I'm thinking. And then it wasn't it, whatever he did was like, oh, no, no, that's not it. That's not it. And then one time at a lunch, Allen just did not know about this project. He just brought these boxes of black and white films. I'm tired of it, can you just get rid of it?
Okay, what is it? This little tiny square thing. And I was looking at it in the sun like, oh. And then I was in my creative mind click like, oh, this is the Scarlatti right here. Oh, this is Debussy right here. And then he was like, what are you doing? Can I use this film and - do whatever you wish! And can I just use it, really use it. I do whatever I wanted. I could go for it. Otherwise it's in my closet. Like, oh my gosh. And from then on, I searched for thousands of his black and white films and that, I love the idea that this slow process of film photography that you take with the film, you go to the same spot multiple times to get that one perfect shot. And then going to the tar room and the develop, it's such a slow process that we can't even think about it this time of digital era.
But at the time, that slow process made it something very beautiful because you wait for the right timing, you don't erase the film, you wait, and then you study the composition and then go back over again. And I love that process of slow process of film photography with my music making or my creation of project or concerts because it's just such a slow process. I wish I can just whip one concert this month and another concert next month. It doesn't work like that for me. Each project takes tremendous amount of thinking and polishing and thinking again, is this right? And then get rid of piece and then see the flow and then talking and all of other aspect. This takes years to make one concert project to the public. I might be cooking for two years, which is unthinkable for some musicians, some people. But that's how I do it.
And when I think of pairing black and white film photography digitalized, because from the film to the projector, I felt home that this is it. This couldn't be more perfect, especially I'm pairing with a poetry that, again, poetry is not like you write it one sentence and that's the perfect sentence. No, you edited and edited and never perfect poetry, never perfect classical music, never perfect. There's no point of completion that master's mind of poetry and just try to succinct in such a way and match the mood of a certain piece. So the Sium concert was all about this piece of music that I want to share, but around it, I'm going to have this army that support this art to elevate it. It was not about poetry, it was not about black and white photography, but those two together to elevate the experience, this music that I'm sharing.
And obviously I wasn't sure how it's going to work, it's going to distract people, is this too much? It said, but then at the end, it couldn't be more perfect than how I shared. And then everybody was very surprised to in that way. And I had struggles and challenges along the way, but at the end I had to trust myself. I am a curator, I'm a bridge. So if I just let my sense, which I know this particular music I'm performing in terms of what emotions that I want to convey or messages the most, well then when I select the photography, when I select the poetry, it may not be the world's best photography, the world best poetry, but that doesn't matter because I am the connector that curating this to experience it, that's still a worthy of it. And when I let go of what will be the best, then it was much easier process.
Trust my sense, trust my belief in the certain particular music. And if I love it, maybe someone might love it too. But if I pretend to pair such a way that because this is well most, well-known the most well within or renowned poetry or renowned photography, that would not mean much personally to me. But when I search one poetry to speak to me really hard out of thousand readings, then that is it for me that I found the jewel for me. And then when I share that in that enthusiasm and passion, I realized there's definitely one or two people moved by it.
Leah Roseman:
You write in your book Jeeyoon about how learners are happier because of well, you express it. Well, I won't quote you. And I was thinking, Allen Brown, this photographer, I read a bit about him. It was interesting. He said he taught himself photography when he was in his sixties and really pursued that. And then in his seventies he learned ballroom dancing and then won some big award. And he seems, and he's doing piano, he's doing all these things as an older individual.
Jeeyoon Kim:
Yeah, the number, it's such a subjective thing. And in the past when we think someone is 60 as if your life is over, now you're preparing just do nothing. But now 60, it's like what? You just get started and it's all in your mind. And the number games continues. If you have X, Y, and G followers, how many CDs did you sell? How many concerts did you have? How many audiences did you come to your concert? How many listeners in your podcast? It goes on and on and on. And we constantly put ourself into the box of numbers, which is very toxic. And when I see someone like Alan, who's 90 still dancing, still take the piano lesson and I remind myself, oh yeah, when I am 70, when I'm 80, I want to keep learning something, whatever that is, I want to keep reading, expand my perspectives, and I want to be surrounded by who's learning too.
And I think ultimately that effort, maybe small effort, makes everything, it's like I found the threshold through piano, pedagogy, education. I found the threshold with the learning, the joy of life and process, the gift of process and humbling process, being a beginner again, and then unlocking the creative mind that we all have just by trying out that I'm beginner because I am doing one thing like a piano for entire my life. I need to keep trying something new to balance out that I am after all human being, that I cannot do all well. And even as a pianist, that I have to accept the insufficient self, that humbling place that this is what I prepare for you. You may not like it, but I would like to share. And in that process, I've learned, I guess one of the biggest lesson of life for myself.
Leah Roseman:
And I know, I don't if you're still surfing, but you studied surfing and I know you're studying Spanish. I also try many different things as it fits. It's sometimes as a musician to go to a regular class time, for example. But it's so important to try new things. Are there things right now you've started that are new for you?
Jeeyoon Kim:
Yeah, I think surfing is still a new thing. And as you could relate, musician spend a lot of time indoors, especially violin at least. I guess you could go outside, but you wouldn't piano impossible. And when pandemic hit, I realized my whole life I prepared to quarantine. Just nothing changed actually. I was just doing my thing daily things that I want to do. I was actually was totally fine doing my thing in quarantine. And I realized, okay, that's good and bad. And I live in San Diego currently, and I realized I'm going to try surfing. That was after pandemic, but a couple years ago, unlike the surfing experience that you see, the videos and everything. And I actually took the surfing very seriously as I would through everything else I do. I learn, I read so many books, I watch a lot of video. I hired professional coach and I just give me how to practice, how to all of it.
And then I went to the beach and then there's no waves, there's no actual, and then come on, I'm ready to take drilling. I need to do at least 20 drills that I facilitate. And then there's no waves, nothing. And I was thinking, huh, where can I drill? Then realized nature doesn't work like that . I was like, really? And then I watched this professional surfer surfing and so easy they're just walking on the longboard and go to the tip and just to turn and like, oh, I think I can just visualize myself doing that. But then I go to the water and even last two years I have major injuries of foot injury, not fingers, thank God, but broken nose and a lot of major injuries that a lot of people was telling me to you, is this wise for you to continue this surfing? And then I had to do deep soul searching and what is wise thing to do?
And then I realized I could die on a sidewalk, just do whatever the reason is. So I can't live life with a fear, but there is things that I need to be more cautious, wear protective gear, when it's a big don't go, learn very safety things that I would do. And if I'm tired, I don't go out. There's always accident happens when you're neglective mode. So I thought, I realized when I am in out there in the water, I'm still such a beginner. And what was one of the most difficult things that I learned is that I hated accepting the fact that I'm just a mediocre, so bad at surfing. I thought I would be so good at it, unlike my hope, I'm not good at it. And what's so bad about it? You just have fun and it's still not easy. But I get to the point that I'm sitting in the board 5:30 in the morning and sunrise in the ocean and the pelicans flying and catching fish for the breakfast and dolphins swim by and make those noise whistle noise and come and say hello and all of it.
And I realized, ah, this is teaching me something that I need to learn through all these struggles of wanting to do well and surfing and to this moment of how amazing is it that I'm this outside of musical world, outside of my own box, out in the nature this early morning. Then when I come back to the music, come back to the piano, I'm more whole, I'm more alive. I am more complete just because of all the mistakes and then be connected with nature so that I did not know I would learn. When I started surfing, I thought I'm going to just really good at surfing and just become my hobby in sports. And no, none of it. My expectation was wasn't true. My expectation was becoming good surfer and good active and now realize that I'm learning. Let it go with surfing importance of connecting with nature and have fun and keep learning, be a humble beginner all over again. And in the lineup, which is in the water. They don't know I'm pianist. They have no idea what I do, doesn't matter what I do. You are become just a human being who loves surfing perhaps. So my identity of pianist doesn't matter and I like that. I think at the end of it, me within my soul, it's not necessarily pianist. I may not play piano. It doesn't mean that I'm not who I am. So it's a very humbling experience that I'm learning through surfing.
Leah Roseman:
Wonderful. Well, I could certainly talk to you all day, but I'm mindful of our time. To close this out, I thought it would be really nice - I'm just going to look up his name. Yes, you lost a dear mentor, Reverend David Bremmer, and I know that he gave you a wonderful piece of advice when you were at Indiana. Could you speak to that?
Jeeyoon Kim:
Yeah. Well actually the other day I was talking to someone about David Bremmer and he was my mentor for a long time. I came to United States when I was 21, and then I am 43 now. So I'm actually tipping point to the more America Korean. But at the same time, I don't feel American all the way. And at this point I don't feel Korean all the way either. So I don't know who I am. I am hybrid, I guess it is, rightfully so. When I came to America, I connect with him and he was a pastor in an American Presbyterian church. And from then on, I would just go to his office and just talk. And often there were life challenges and I would tell him, because I did not have much of support system like that, I don't have family here. And he was like a father figure for me.
And then there's audition or competition or the doctorate auditions that I was so struggling with. Every failure that I felt was so huge, I didn't get into that school. I failed a competition. I worked so hard. You don't even understand. I work so hard, why? And I also went through many, many difficult life, personal lives, divorce and all of it. Every time I ask why I don't deserve this, I worked so hard. If there's anyone who worked hard, it would be me. Anyone who wanted to make anything to work in relationship wise, it's me. Why happens to me? Why, why? And every time when I bring those questions, I just want to know why. Is there any lesson that I need to learn here? I was complaining. And then he said, just very matter of fact tone, although he's a very loving person, and he will say, don't ask why. Always ask "what now" and now go back to your practice from practice. Like, oh.
And then I thought about it over the years after his passing too. Whenever I feel why, then I hear now his voice telling me, don't ask why, just ask what now. And that simple life wisdom saved me so much misery of my life. And it is so true, because why is looking backwards in the past, which I cannot change. What now ask, being present and forward and making an action of whatever you can do to move forward, and that by doing some action now, it propel your life in a positive direction. Why? I'm pondering why which I'm pondering something I cannot control. I live in the past, which is also very dark and passive and depressing actually. So that lesson alone, I often ask, and I don't want to go to the why question, but inevitably as a human, we do go there. But whenever I do that, I ask: What now, what can I do now? And then I get up again. Smile. Stand tall and walk.
Leah Roseman:
Beautifully expressed. Thank you so much. So thanks so much for joining me here today. Maybe we can have you back on the podcast later on.
Jeeyoon Kim:
I would love to.
Leah Roseman:
I hope you enjoyed this episode. Please to share this with your friends and check out episodes you may have missed leahroseman.com. If you could buy me a coffee to support the series, that would be wonderful. The link is in the description. Have a wonderful week.
