Kerson Leong: Transcript
Leah Roseman:
Hello, welcome to Violin Virtuoso, Kerson Leong.
Kerson Leong:
Hello. Thank you so much for having me, Leah.
Leah Roseman:
I'm really looking forward to this conversation, but I know that you agreed to play some music for us at the beginning.
Kerson Leong:
Absolutely. So I thought I would just play a little movement from Ysaÿe, one of his six sonatas for solo violin, the fourth. This is the first movement, it's funny since each sonata is dedicated to one of Ysaÿe's colleagues and of course this one is dedicated to a name that I think we all love very much, Fritz Kreisler.
Leah Roseman:
That's right.
Kerson Leong:
So this is the first movement from that, it's called the Allemanda.
Leah Roseman:
Thank you so much. Take your time.
Leah Roseman:
Wow. Thank you so much, that was completely transporting. You really captured a lot of the improvisatory feel of these pieces.
Kerson Leong:
Absolutely. Well actually it's nice that you point that out because for me originally, the reason why I actually got very interested in exploring the whole set of sonatas in depth is in a way it was... I saw the opportunity to at once be grounded completely, musically, to have to establish some sort of overall architecture, but also to have this foundation. But in the end also to push some certain creative impulses as well that somehow these pieces and their characters, they allow me to do that but within a certain established sphere. So yeah, for me to be at once reverent, but also creative in a sense.
Leah Roseman:
Eugène Ysaÿe, a Belgian violinist, not everyone knows who he was. He was actually a pretty interesting musical figure.
Kerson Leong:
Absolutely. He was a very, you could say, legendary figure of the first half of the 20th century. In fact I think one of his, I forgot exactly who it was, but one of his esteemed colleagues that said he was probably the first violinist in history to play completely in tune. But he was very much considered the first modern violinist where he laid down a lot of the foundation for a lot of the technical expectations, but also perhaps pointed the way for the sound world as well that we find ourselves in. And of course throughout the 20th century, he was very much an influence on many of his younger colleagues from Milstein, for example, called him the Tsar, Russian for King, of the violin.
Kerson Leong:
So he is very much an esteemed figure and you can tell by these sonatas but also just in general he was a very, in a way, prolific composer as well that had many different ideas, interesting ideas and you could tell also that he was quite ahead of his time. For example, even taking one of his violin sonatas, the fifth one, you get the sense that he's very much ahead of his time. It's very abstract, it allows for much exploration and creativity, in ways looking into the future very much. So yeah, definitely a figure I think that I would love more people to know and also to hear his music. Because for me, I think when it comes down to it, I was mainly very struck by the musical language, it was something that hit very personal for me. So the idea to record the six sonatas after performing them several times in concert was inevitable for me.
Leah Roseman:
So talk about where you recorded them.
Kerson Leong:
Yeah, so this recording I recorded a few months before the start of the pandemic, actually. At the concert hall of Le Domaine Forget, which is on the shores of the St. Lawrence deep in Quebec, an hour and a half or two hours north of Quebec city. And it's a wonderful place, they have a wonderful music festival, music academy and they have a wonderful concert hall as well that's acoustically excellent. And so it was really a luxury to do it in such a place and also with such an excellent producer as well with Carl Talbot. I worked with him for my very first album, actually a few years back called Bis. It was a collection of Encore pieces or short pieces with piano with Philip Chiu, so I really enjoyed my experience. It was a very enlightening experience, so it was an obvious choice to work with him again.
Kerson Leong:
And so what we actually did was we stripped down all the curtains on the walls of the hall, which is already very reverberant, which is very live sounding, but we made it even more in the direction of a cathedral in a way by stripping down to have more hard surfaces and concrete, for example, that we could really create this atmosphere that was very appropriate for the vision that I had for these pieces. And also Carl's idea of my sound as well, it was very much a collaboration in that sense. So yeah, we recorded it in a space of four days, the six sonatas and it was one of those experiences that is so intensely personal in a way that you wouldn't forget for the rest of your life, even though of course I think I was physically and mentally and emotionally torn apart by the end. But I think those are one of those moments that you go through that you're like, okay, these are the moments that define my life in a way.
Leah Roseman:
And you have a personal connection to Ysaÿe in that your mentor, Dumay studied with Milstein who studied with Ysaÿe right?
Kerson Leong:
Yeah, basically. In a way it's funny because of course Ysaÿe can be considered as part of the Franco-Belgian school of violin playing and actually in a way I could be considered through the, if you want to call it the lineage, as part of that as well through of course Augustin Dumay, who I worked with for four years in the Queen Elizabeth music chapel in Belgium. In turn of course he studied with Milstein and with Grumiaux as well. Grumiaux was also promo of the Franco-Belgium school. So in a way, it's definitely a sound world that I feel very close to I think and also having grown up with the great players of the 20th century. Those were always recordings and always images that were around when I was growing up.
Kerson Leong:
Of course my tastes have greatly diversified since, but it still remains a sound word that's very familiar in a way and that's very close. And it's something that I can draw from, I find, very naturally at this point is the kind of ideals that they would've had or I would perceive in that era of playing or that style of playing. The texture and the sound, the development of notes even within individual notes, such development and such texture and such layering. I think there's certain aspects, whether you want to call it old fashioned or not, but I think there are certain aspects that you perceive in the sound of players of that era that I really take inspiration from.
Leah Roseman:
And You were Artist in Residence at the Queen Elizabeth chapel in Waterloo, Belgium. And Ysaÿe founded that.
Kerson Leong:
Absolutely, absolutely.
Leah Roseman:
It's a pretty special place.
Kerson Leong:
...founded with the institution with Queen Elizabeth of Belgium and Queen Elizabeth was also very much a violin enthusiast and music lover. So in a way it's pretty amazing been aware of Ysaÿe's music and from a certain distance. Of course, we all in the violin playing world hear Ysaÿe's name at some point, but then after a certain while to come to a place that is so directly linked to such a composer and to such a history, that really fascinated me a lot more and definitely played a huge part in my interest in these sonatas and wanting to record them .
Leah Roseman:
But your experience at the Queen Elizabeth chapel, it's not a regular music school by any stretch. Can you speak to that.
Kerson Leong:
It's definitely not a regular conservatory or regular institution with a curriculum, I would characterize it as more of a stepping stone institution in the ways that you allow for professional experience or getting used to giving concerts and collaborating on projects and collaborating with, whether it's your fellow young musicians or with people who have much more experienced than you have. For example Augustin Dumay, but also Gary Hoffman for example, Miguel da Silva, Louis Lortie was of course also Canadian. And so that was a really cool institution to be part of and there was also this aspect of that symbolized professional life, professional experience but also this very private side as well. Because the music chapel itself is situated in the middle of a forest almost that's just on the edge of a town called Waterloo, that's the battle of Waterloo, that's where it's famous from.
Kerson Leong:
But it's a very secluded, very calm area and also has state-of-the-art facilities where at least for me, it really allowed me to go inwards and to have the time and the space and the peace to really explore things in depth. But just within yourself, your own relationship with the music and that I think was extremely consequential in a sense that it gave me the awareness of what was actually possible with that kind of intensity of looking inward. What can come out? What kind of revelations would you have? And I think because of that, it was a very fruitful time and experience.
Leah Roseman:
I'm curious about your interpretation of Bach. I got to hear the recent solo recital that was broadcast on behalf of the Scotia music festivals. Amazing, amazing recital, thank you for that. And I was pleasantly surprised, I didn't expect your Bach to be that full of Baroque color. I just expected it to be more romantic, honestly. So what kind of influences did you have when you were studying in Europe?
Kerson Leong:
Yeah. For me, when it comes to something like Bach, Ysaÿe, stuff like this, it was very much for each of these separate repertoires a very personal, or I have a very personal way of approaching it. But certainly for Bach, of course I was influenced at the beginning, I'd heard the Bach cycles by Szeryng for example, by Grumiaux, by Milstein. Of course those are powerful renditions that you can never really forget, but also I think recently I've just been really inspired by the excitement that's going on in the Baroque scene at the moment as well. Especially what I've seen in Europe, for example, there's such an interest and there's such an energy and care that is very inspirational that I find in this kind of new Baroque approach that's really influenced me a lot.
Kerson Leong:
I think also it's a lot about having really started to listen to organ music, for example, or in general I'm very influenced by keyboard music and the purity that comes along with it, or at least the purity that I perceive. And very much this sense of purity and this sense of essence, stripping down things, I think has also very much influenced my Bach playing a lot. And also when it comes to choir music as well, there's a simplicity to it and yet there's a real all-encompassing aspect. And so I try to, for Bach, encompass that in the sound. Capture that element of simplicity, but also that expansiveness that can come with that and to try and strip things down to its essence as I see it.
Kerson Leong:
And of course that would also have influenced my Ysaÿe playing, obviously there was a direct link as well because Ysaÿe was directly inspired by Bach. Six sonatas, three sonatas and three partitas. So six for Bach, six for Ysaÿe and the first sonata was directly inspired by a performance of the Bach G minor sonata so the first sonata. So everything is very linked. Of course it's a completely different sound world that allows for a lot more consistent with Ysaÿe 's time or that kind of sound world that allows you to wear your heart on your sleeve perhaps or be a lot more in a way extroverted expression or intention. Expressive intention. However, there is also that expansiveness and that purity that also comes along, I think. So in a way it's very interesting for both approaches to be very distinct but also for them to have very many things in common as well.
Leah Roseman:
So speaking of different sound worlds, during the lockdown I know you did some really fun arrangements that you've put up on your YouTube. Beautiful "Oblivion" by Piazzolla and I believe you're playing viola in that as well.
Kerson Leong:
Yes.
Leah Roseman:
Have you played quite a bit of viola in chamber music?
Kerson Leong:
I haven't yet actually. The closest that you could call chamber music with viola I did with Jonathan Crow several years ago. This was a long time ago and Jonathan is a former professor of mine and a very dear friend now. And we played a Passacaglia together. It was the very first time that, even though it was I think for a small house concert, it was my first venture if you could call it that into the viola world. I just find that for me, the viola, it represents, it's of same essence of the violin but at the same time I find that it gives me this ability to separate myself from a lot of, let's say, established notions or things that already are... It just gives me another avenue to explore perhaps other concepts or other sound worlds or even other styles that I'd be interested in. You could call it my guilty pleasure instrument, I do play it quite a bit in private at my own leisure. But I think it's just something that I love using for that kind of exploration.
Kerson Leong:
I think for me though, I think for me to play classical repertoire or play chamber music repertoire with viola, I would give myself several months or a good chunk of time to settle in, to develop the kind of sound idea that you would if you would be playing your main instrument. That's a respect that you give to the instrument, but also to the music that you play. So that would be what I think about that. But for now I think it's definitely something that I love to just explore new things with at my leisure, it's very much that guilty pleasure instrument.
Leah Roseman:
And when you make arrangements, are you doing it on a keyboard? Are you hearing everything in your head? How do you do that?
Kerson Leong:
Yeah. Of course, you would have to notate it somewhere so I have a MIDI keyboard for that which helps a lot. But it usually just comes from when you hear something and you let your imagination go wild, so it's different representations of the same atmosphere or the same idea. So I just try and, well I don't even try sometimes, I just let it go almost. Let my imagination go, let myself be as creative as I can or be very almost casual about it. Even though of course everything I do, there's definitely a weight to it, everything that I want to do is something that I really do believe in. Even if something like a simple arrangement, I do want to do the material justice as well.
Kerson Leong:
So yeah, it tends to happen all in the head. Then I try it out and if something works, if I like how things... And sometimes of course I have to see if things fit together. Let's say there's many different voices in one, then I find, okay, let's just work, do these two work together? Then I go like that and then I start to notate and it's a really fun process, I think. It's really stimulating and it also allows me to free myself in many different ways and also free myself from the instrument as well. I think that's actually something that very much throughout is a general goal is to when you make music, to transcend the instrument or to make yourself or other people forget about the instrument but just to behold the music itself or the idea itself. And I think doing arrangements and letting my mind run like this I think is a great way of reinforcing that.
Leah Roseman:
Kind of a balancing break too from all the woodshedding we have to do.
Kerson Leong:
Of course. Yes, of course.
Leah Roseman:
And you have a really interesting connection with physics.
Kerson Leong:
Yeah. It's something that started with my dad, actually. My dad is a physicist and after a certain while, of course he was always very much a music lover, but after a while he started to take interest, like going to observe different musicians, for example, different violinists, to observe what they say. But also try and start to make connections between what would first seem as ideas that would be contradictory, let's say, or expressed differently and to find connections from a scientific point of view. He taught me a lot about how things actually function, like how the string behaves when it vibrates and what would be the optimum way to excite it and to how to think about it.
Kerson Leong:
So all these things, of course I wouldn't consider myself at all a physics expert, definitely not, but I think a lot of these things that my dad has experimented with me with have really influenced the way to apply these ideas. I would find my own way to interpret these ideas and that would influence my playing a lot to the point where actually several years back my dad and I, he would use me as a sort of guinea pig which is actually kind of cool, it was very interesting. Together I mean, me as the guinea pig and he gave lectures about the subject, for example, in Beijing during the Menuhin competition in 2012, I think. In some universities in California as well and in Norway as well. It's something that I constantly think about. It's not something that perhaps I'm aware of or I try to think of specifically the scientific aspect while I play, it becomes a natural process, but it's still something that evolves and also evolves my approach as well constantly.
Leah Roseman:
The strings they vibrate sideways, right?
Kerson Leong:
In a way it's very cool because when you see a string vibrate, actually there's a kink that kind of goes around. Helmholtz motion, basically. It's almost as if the string is turning, it's going around in a loop. There's this certain kink that goes throughout the whole length of the string and throughout the whole amplitude and it just goes around and goes and spins and spins. So there's this idea that actually over time made me think of the bow action, or bow motions less as a straight point A to point B, but actually more as a constant transformation of energy, whether it's a storing of energy or it's the release of energy.
Kerson Leong:
So no matter how sharp the articulation, how soft a dynamic, how fast a note, how short, how long, I would try and think of it always as a transformation of energy. So everything has this release to it. I think that's a big key to sound production, especially the projection in a concert hall is that it's basically releasing a lot of the energy that's built up, not just transferring it onto the instrument with force, so to say, but to find the way through not just relaxation, but controlled use of tension as well. That's very big, it's a controlled release of tension that can create that kind of release in the sound and it's definitely something that you can perceive in the sound as well, when sound is properly released.
Leah Roseman:
Yeah, we can definitely hear it in your sound. I'm curious about a couple of ways you have of working. Do you have basics or warmups that you tend to keep doing or have you kind of dropped that by now
Kerson Leong:
Yeah, sure. I focus a lot these days on sort the speed of physical transitions. Especially, for example, in the left hand. The speed of let's say anything from finger dropping or finger lifting to change notes, shifting, even stretching. But all to do it, and to do it at a speed, let's say to work it up to a certain speed where it becomes very active, almost like an impulse. There's the least amount of big muscle activity involved in making such small actions because there's simply no need, I think. And it really does keep me very reactive, you could say. That I feel I focus on a lot when I slowly get back into playing, also to recuperate after a long concert. The next day I would also start slowly with that and slowly work my way to make sure there's not more tension that there needs to be.
Kerson Leong:
And I always try to when it comes to the bow arm as well, just to make sure that there is... It's sort of like dividing things into infinitesimals. To make sure that in every instant of the bow that you absolutely know exactly what you're doing and you focus really on that. You are locked for a period in your practice where that's really the main focus, whereas otherwise when you're actually playing it becomes second nature, becomes something that you don't think about. But I think that emphasis on body awareness, that's something that makes up a big part of my warmups.
Leah Roseman:
I'm impressed because you're young and you obviously have such facility from such a young age that you have that analytical side because you've produced these really great YouTube videos talking about technique. And I think that's great because if you just rely on the instinctive part, at a certain point if things aren't working then it's a lot of work to figure that out. Because at a certain point we're always our own teachers, right?
Kerson Leong:
Absolutely. Because I think it's also experiences or lessons that you take from growing up or just from life in general. I think there was definitely, I mean, seeing, looking back in the years when I would be transitioning from the 13 year old or the 14 year old that just having won Menuhin competition is starting to kind of do that. But then of course transitioning from that to let's say when you're 15, 16, when you become self-conscious when things you lose certain things, you don't understand why, just become less fearless. I think those were very much low points in my life as well during that period. There were certain things, certain circumstances, during those times that would really force me to look inward and look at my own body and try and really understand certain things for myself without of course having it be a constant obsession. But I think it was more just like a way to cope with myself.
Kerson Leong:
With artists, I think we're always in a contest with ourselves, we're always very much looking at ourselves with a critical point of view and this was just a way to process that in a healthy way. And so a lot of this technical work and also just the technical setup and you could even say the technical style as well and the way I do things stems very much from that. It's the general idea of finding myself in times when you feel the necessity to because you're losing yourself. You had one version of yourself when you were a so-called young kid, young prodigy or whatever but then that would fade away. Then you would have to find what is really the essence within yourself. And so I think the technical aspect, the analytical side of playing was just one aspect of that.
Leah Roseman:
It's just a nerdy question. One thing you said I found super interesting, you mentioned about the thumb that needs a certain strength and you talk about its independence and that was a lightning bolt moment for me because all I've ever really heard people talk about, including I think Galamian, keep that thing relaxed and it's always about relaxing the thumb. But of course there's counter pressure and we do need strength in the thumb. And for me, one of my problems is it has a tendency to get in the wrong position and I have to keep reminding myself, get that where it needs to be for my hand to work properly because I have a super small hand. But if you could elaborate on that a little bit more about the thumb.
Kerson Leong:
Yeah, absolutely. I think I was basically talking from the position, it comes from the aspect of security in a way. Sometimes of course we are afraid of the thumb slipping or losing position. So a lot of subtle tension could arise just from that fear alone and I think that the strengthening aspect is to increase security, is to just basically assure yourself a little bit more, to make sure that your thumb is able to respond to subtle changes in the left hand. Especially I think even just going one step back, I think it really stemmed from my experimenting with playing without shoulder rest.
Leah Roseman:
I was just going to ask about that.
Kerson Leong:
Yeah, absolutely. It's actually a huge technical topic for me, I think it was one of the if not the most consequential for me was to stop playing with shoulder rests. I think it was around when I was 16 or 17, so maybe around eight years ago I would say that I made that decision. It was less about removing the shoulder rest itself, but it just made me realize what a world of technical subtleties and things, especially in the left arm and left hand, especially if you think of holding a violin as a balance, as a balance of responsibility between the left hand, the thumb is a big part of that obviously, and the shoulder or collarbone. There's a whole wealth of things that you end up learning that you had no idea existed before because the shoulder rest did a lot of it for you.
Kerson Leong:
So the thumb, I just find if it lacked the strength, the elasticity that comes along with it to be able to adjust quickly to different position changes, then there can be an amount of tension that can build up either in this part or even further down the arm that we may not realize. And so I think that was something that I felt, sometimes you would feel that tension, you would figure out why but then you would actually end up just doing some random thumb exercises for example. Even just to be able to crawl the thumb, to crawl the thumb and to have the security of able to crawl the fingerboard or crawl the neck with your thumb without any of the other fingers involved and without shoulder rest involved. I think that's immediately something that gives perspective and not only strengthens the thumb, makes it feels more warmed up and more reactive, but it's very much assurance as well.
Leah Roseman:
And I just want to ask you about your process of memorization for new music.
Kerson Leong:
Yeah, absolutely. It's been very hard to actually to express it concretely. It's been something I've always been thinking, how do you explain it? For me it's always been quite an intuitive process. When you hear a piece of music then you're able to sort of map it out, but actually what makes the mapping possible or at least what starts the process is when you think more in the bigger picture, in a sense. It's not only the harmonic functions in the piece, but also the feelings or the specific sensations that those harmonies give. And in a way I would imagine it's almost like if an actor is memorizing let's say a play or something and there's of course pressure of delivery and there's all these factors that combine. That it's like one word or one word that appears that immediately opens the door to another paragraph, those are the markers that set in your head and I think very much the very personal perception of color that comes from harmony, from analyzing it, grouping it into bigger harmonic changes or whatever is very much like that. One feeling sets off another section and reminds you, okay, this is what comes along with it.
Kerson Leong:
For example, when I was performing Bartók's second concerto, for example, which is quite a difficult one to memorize because it's quite a lot of different things. Also things are not predictable, a lot of times you have to rely on muscle memory to execute the passage work. But for me, it was to try and really... Of course you practice individual passage work, but then you try and group it into a way, especially with harmonic language, as rich, as mind boggling and as evocative as Bartók's. That was very much a help, I think. I guess that's the best way I could describe it is that one harmony, you select one harmony or one feeling, one sensation that immediately becomes a marker for another section that helps you navigate.
Leah Roseman:
That's very interesting. And upcoming projects, what's coming up for you?
Kerson Leong:
Yeah. So next month I'll be performing with the Les Violons du Roy. I'm very excited, it will be the first time that I work with them. Also I'm going to be performing two concerts for Toronto Summer Music as well in Toronto with virtual concerts. One chamber music concert on the 27th, I believe, with Stéphane Tétreault, cellist and Angela Schwarzkopf, harpist. And also of course the other concert with the National Academy Orchestra where I will be performing a Mendelssohn concerto as well as a modern concerto by composer Avner Doman. So yeah, very excited.
Kerson Leong:
I've been very lucky actually during the pandemic to continue to do occasional virtual concerts. These are experiences that once you have this particular perspective, that you miss a lot of these things. Obviously you never take any of these things for granted as well, there's such a nourishment and in a way such a privilege as well to make music and to make music with colleagues as well. So I'm just very excited, very happy and fingers just crossed for next season. I think things are starting to happen again, I guess. So we'll hope for the best.
Leah Roseman:
Yeah. There'll be links to all your upcoming things in the description of this video as well. Of course, your website, which will be updated, so if people listen to this later on they'll see what you're currently up to. And just finally, do you have any words of advice for aspiring virtuosos, for children out there working really hard who really want to be Kerson Leong?
Kerson Leong:
For me, I think it comes down to, when I look at my path, you could call it, a lot of things happen in a very non-linear way. But a lot of those things that were set into motion were because of course at a certain age when you're young, when you enjoy doing something from a particular perspective and you become good at it, it becomes fluent. But I think when it comes to becoming not just a virtuoso but an all-encompassing musician and a serious musician at that, for me at least I recognized there was a moment when I was 16 or 17 when suddenly music making became personal. That it wasn't just a fun activity anymore or in some cases what felt like a chore or an obligation or just something that you do as extracurricular activity, whatever it might be. But it just suddenly became a necessity for life, for living, for the exploration of yourself and a necessity for growing up as well.
Kerson Leong:
So I think what I could say from that is the most important thing is to, and I think a lot of it happens not only with music education, the importance of that, but also the importance of the mindset that you have when you practice. I know that when you're young, practicing may not be the most natural thing, may not be the thing that you want to do the most but I think it's a worthwhile thing to find pleasure in the little details. To find fascination with things that over a period of time you may take for granted, or you may get used to, but I think it's that mindset of fascination of constantly being... That pleasure that drives the want to get better and the want to explore more.
Kerson Leong:
And so that's what I would say. Just take pleasure into little details and to really find a personal relationship with the music. Find perhaps music that you love to play, work towards pieces of music that you would love to play. I think that would be, in my mind, the ideal way to start at least. So yeah, enjoy and really find your connection with the music.
Leah Roseman:
That's great advice for all musicians, amateur or professional. You speak so eloquently about music, I found this conversation really inspiring and thanks so much for playing at the beginning. Of course, people can hear your recordings and hear the beautiful sound of the Domaine Forget hall as well. So thanks so much.
Kerson Leong:
Thank you so much Leah for having me.
